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Topic: About spells not displayed

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About spells not displayed
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It has been done for convenience and blabla, but I realy dislike the fact that spells dosen't show up, especially the ones like mirror image, since not having them to show is does have an impact on the gameplay (you know how much time you need to hit to get it down) and the fact that spells won't show on mages is cheating because knowing that a mage is warded is quite important before strating a fight.

I know it has been done for because our poor little casters *coughs* don't want to dispel all thier 30 buffs because they look like giant will o' the wisp when doing some RP after a combat but its part of the condition of beign a caster, removing the GFX entierly isn't a proper solution since there is a pack of lighter GFXs who makes the thing less visualy annoying :

http://nwvault.ign.com/View.php?view=nwn2visualeffects.detail&id=12



-- Edited by Hydra on Tuesday 26th of February 2013 05:55:10 AM

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The argument of "coolness" and good looking are quite irrelevant for it begin an excuse to obvious cheating, if you want coolness don't cast spells that looks ugly plain simple. Its more regarding NPCs, but all right don't be surprised if some NPCs abuses of the "coolness" :p

 

I have nothing against re-doing the hak myself if its the main issue.



-- Edited by Hydra on Tuesday 26th of February 2013 04:31:01 PM

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The Archbuilder
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I really don't want to do the effects hak again, and there are several reasons for the no buffs vs. partial buffs hak (for the record, yes, I've used both in the past):

1) Nobody's system chokes when a buffed character enters the room; Nobody is expending any graphics resources on the exact same effects they will see every single combat quest
2) You can examine the mage to see what effects they have going if it really bugs you that much
3) You never could tell which buffs were which when all of them were going at once--you'd mostly see the skin effect and one bubble effect and a lot of random stuff
4) Mirror image is an important one to see, but there was never a good mirror image effect (like the BG mirror image). Its just another shiny blingy thing that gets lost in the crowd--of yes, even the reduced buff set.
5) Everyone but two main PCs is a spellcaster. We're all going to see each other's buff sequences countless times before going into combat. In a big fight, the non-spellcasters are going to get buffed too. There shouldn't be many surprises here.

And finally, screenshots look less cool when everyone is wearing a protection from evil bubble.

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Not sure how abuse is going about with out the visual effects of the Spells.. I'd rather not have the visuals because I have a hard enough time navigating and getting dizzy from the swirling protection spells. For those folks with spell craft they'll be able to have a general Idea of what spell is being cast anyway..

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Lord of the Forge
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Seriously, what abuse? The spell VFX were an utterly retarded design decision on Obsideon's part from the start that served no purpose other than to a) make people look stupid and b) choke frame rates on every system. I fail to see how the removal of this FPS killing eyesore amounts to cheating... No one has ever relied on the visual cue to tell if a spell is being cast or not anyhow.



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The Archbuilder
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It would only be a possible point of abuse if we were a hardcore PvP server. When it comes to PCs vs. Monsters, I've always found that people figure out the monster's abilities monster by monster, as opposed to via tons of glowy visual cues. After all, most of a creature's stats are hidden from us in its inventory and character sheet, and if we're sitting there plotting strategy, its "temporary" effects are still visible under its description.

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The only good reason I see here is Emeryin reason because it regards health and head-sickness so I'll not insist. I don't think its a retarded design decision for many reason I don't feel like arguing like the fact that they're easy to spot from afar, IMHO its annoying as wearing a full-plate in real life should be, looking silly for a greater protection isn't too much of a price to pay.

However I'd like to know if there is way by using the override to make that spells visible or not visible again ? So we can make the spell GFX appear/disappear something optional and I'm ready to do that pack, even if its for personal use.

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My health aside.. I do not see the point in having the visual effects aside from wanting Visual stimuli... and a hit to the player "Ohe Hey guess what this NPC has magical buffs on him!" I'm use to just imagining things and accepting that most spells in D&D do not have anything flashy about them Unless specifically designed to be so.. Mage Armor I always interpreted as a solidifying resistances to the air about the character similar to a second skin almost.. not some orb of color about the character.. much like I've seen here in the game, or the flower effect for the protection spell... I'd rather not have to worry about the visual effects of certain spells at all because to me it is clutter and really not necessary.

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The Archbuilder
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Yes, the same effect can be gained via an override, but considering that most people like not having the visual effects, that would be putting the extra burden of re-installing something we already have on the majority of us.

As for the point about bad design--its not necessarily a bad design decision to have visual effects on spells, but how they went about it was pretty silly looking.

Also, invalidating everyone else's opinion because you like your opinion more is not a valid argument, Hydra. It is a fact that while my laptop can take full shadows and tons of point lights in NWN2, it chokes when a fully-buffed spellcaster enters the room (even with reduced effects). I would rather it choke on something remotely interesting.

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Well I'll make an override with the Less Obtrusive Spell Buffs mod and the spells like mirror image you removed for people who want it. Removing visual effects from a game should ever be something optional not enforced, what is "coolness" for some isn't for others and sure if your computer have problems handling spells, remove the GFX but I have a problem about arbitrary removal of visual content with no other options.



-- Edited by Hydra on Wednesday 27th of February 2013 01:30:38 PM

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Hydra, the override was put in with everyone's interest in mind. Seeing as how this is the very first time any of us have ever heard anyone requesting for the effects to be put in/ anyone having a problem with ugly VFX being removed, I'd say it was the right call. As has been repeated, the addition of the hak in question was far from an arbitrary move. The reasons- plentiful enough- have already been listed above.

The absence of the spell VFX is also not something game breaking or even intrusive, so expecting anyone to redo and re-download the entire pack because of effects the vast majority of the server don't even want to see is dubious to say the least.

As for the part about how it "should" look as silly as real life full plate or visually undesirable... what? No really, what? Since when was it ever desirable in any game for your character to look like an idiot dressing up as a Christmas tree on Halloween? I assumed that's the whole point of things like the appearance changer. And mind you the buff VFX do not just apply to "our poor little casters", the annoyance- practical and aesthetically- applies to all characters subjected to these spells. As has been mentioned, if you want your pc to notice magic, make your roll or just examine the target, its not like anyone ever lies about these things anyhow.

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Just pointing a lil fact to all VFX'ers--- ever wonder why there's e.g. "Detect Magic" spell in PnP? Because the sodding spells don't have swirly WTF's surrounding the casters like Xmas balls... sans a few obvious ones like Mirror Image and Stoneskin et al. If you want to start seeing magic, start getting Detect Magic and its friends, IMO wink - just saying, the Obsidian folks were on an LSD trip while they designed the spell effects. IMO spells should have no visual cues, unless the spell itself states so in SRD or alike.



-- Edited by anikaiful on Thursday 28th of February 2013 08:17:54 AM

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perhaps I am recalling a conversation before the forums were open. but I do beleive there were several folks whom requested that the visual effects be toned down if not removed from some spells.. since the 'hamster ball'? as I've heard it referred as was bothersome. I could be misremembering but.. I could have sworn a good number of folks weighed in favor of the removal.
IF you desire to override the Spell FX to allow it to display for you. There isn't much I can do to prevent you from doing so, I am not going to be an inconsiderate person and prevent folks from doing such.

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Thank you, I couldn't have put it better myself. =)

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